In reality, there is no finding consensus with Democrats on abortion. They are fanatics on abortion, as much as ISIS is fanatical on their version of Islam. It’s their 1st commandment, Thou shall fully believe in abortion and allow no restrictions. If the GOP said “we’ll give you an assault weapons ban and in exchange we get a 20 week abortion ban (remember, most EU nations have shorter abortion bans. France is at 14 weeks)” they’ll say “hell no.” It won’t even be something like “OK, we’ll do the assault weapon thing now and work on the 20 week ban later.” Just “NO”.
Haley: Republicans need to be ‘honest’ about abortion
In the wake of a brutal round of elections for anti-abortion advocates, former U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley emphasized at Wednesday night’s presidential debate that Republicans need to be “honest” about the country’s appetite for abortion restrictions.
In response to a question from NBC moderator Kristen Welker about how Republicans should address abortion, Haley said that it’s up to the states to decide how they handle abortion rights. But she noted that Republicans pushing for a federal abortion ban are not being forthright about the feasibility of passing such legislation, as it would need 60 Senate votes.
“As much as I’m pro-life, I don’t judge anyone for being pro-choice, and I don’t want them to judge me for being pro-life,” she said. “Let’s find consensus. … We don’t need to divide America over this issue anymore.”
Haley’s response — striking in its modesty compared to other harder-line stances from GOP rivals like Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and South Carolina Sen. Tim Scott — came on the heels of Ohio’s overwhelming passage of a referendum Tuesday codifying abortion rights in the state constitution. Now, with anti-abortion forces reeling after a string of defeats at the state level, Haley is attempting to plot a more compromising path forward for her party.
The Ohio referendum wasn’t the only win for abortion rights on Tuesday. Virginia Democrats won full control of the state legislature based on campaigns that centered on abortion rights, blocking Republican Gov. Glenn Youngkin’s hopes of passing legislation that would restrict access to abortion.
Well, when it comes to any sort of federal legislation, I’m as against a ban as I am against Democrats push to legalize it federally. It doesn’t belong there. That’s what the Supreme Court decision was saying. It is a 10th Amendment issue. It is for the States and The People, and the People cannot give their power to the federal government voluntarily.
You know (or not) my stance on abortion: I tend to only get involved policy-wise. Having moral debates on the subject go downhill way, way worse than trying to have a conversation about Trump. It’s not a subject I’m really invested in, it’s not a subject that is high on my priorities. For many of you, it may be. Some are very opposed to capital punishment, both on the right and left.
From a political point of view, arguing for bans and such on abortion are losers in American politics. We saw that in 2022 and Tuesday night. Sure, the losses weren’t all about abortion, but, as the GOP talks about even minor restrictions Democrats will flock to the polls, it drives away some Independents, and even some Republicans are not happy. And since Republicans on the big stage do not know how to actually talk about even minor restrictions, it will cause election losses. Pushing bans just doesn’t fly. They could have pushed for a 16, 18, or 20 week ban except to save the life of the mother, treating abortion facilities as medical facilities, using contraception as contraception rather than abortion as contraception, and slow rolled it. Instead they went hard, and lost. Bans in one state will drive abortion supporter turnout in others.
Some may say “it’s worth it to lose if we can get rid of abortion.” No, sorry, it won’t work like that. Democrats will first sue, and often find judges that will rule that way. Further, they will take state general assemblies and governor’s mansion, and, even with a tiny majority they will pass laws supporting abortion. Then, if the GOP wins and try to get rid of those laws friendly judges will reject those laws.
Much like federal agencies, it’s not going away. Even limits after so many weeks won’t happen. It would have to be a long term promise, and Republicans are terrible at explaining their policies this century. If we want to win in 2024 we need to be focused on the economy and reducing government dictates, with a side on how so many Democrats hate Israel and Jews and on crafting wise legislation on security the border. That’s it. (of course, Republicans are great at not discussing what they really should) People can disagree with me all they want (I had that contentious discussion with a few Republican voting coworkers, and it went worse than yammering with Trump haters), but, it’s a losing issue at the ballot box.
“Let’s bring people together and decide what we can agree on,” Haley said. “But don’t make the American people think that you’re going to push something on them when we don’t even have the votes in the Senate.”
Republicans have struggled with their messaging on abortion, especially since Roe v. Wade was overturned. Before the debate on Wednesday, RNC Chair Ronna McDaniel, who has been getting heat for the GOP losses on Tuesday, called again for Republicans to engage on the issue.
“We cannot ignore abortion,” McDaniel said on the “Ruthless” podcast. “We cannot cross-advertise and run only crime ads and then the Democrats run abortion ads and then we sit and pretend like that’s not being discussed.”
There is no consensus, just drop it. And we should ignore it at least till the elections are over, then work on discussing why there should be limits and other things.
“Consensus” is the battle cry of the unimaginative.
Leadership creates solutions with innovation and moving the issue forward. Taking a poll to triangulate what position she should have is the time-honored tactic of the professional politician with no personal principles. If she cannot announce what the consensus position should be and use her influence to bring people to it, she is just flapping her gums.
Example: I believe abortion is an invasive medical procedure and should be regulated by the states using their existing procedures for regulating the practice of medicine. I further believe that insurance companies should cover it or not cover it and charge prices for that coverage according to well-established principles of risk, demographics, and costs. Abortion providers should be regulated according to the same rules for similar practices in their state and subject to redress for injuring their patients if that happens. So pro-life people can buy health insurance from companies that do not pay for abortions and see a lower cost of insurance than companies who do cover it. Policies for women under 50 would be more expensive to cover that procedure, as well as pregnancy and breast cancer risks.
Problem is, for 60 years, both parties have used this as a wedge issue. I guess there are fewer than 10% of the population who are capable of accepting the language I used in my example. There can be no consensus on this issue. Same for Global warming and BLM/DIE.
William Teach: In reality, there is no finding consensus with Democrats on abortion.
So is Mr Teach saying there is no resolution to the abortion issue?
Many pro-lifers consider ANY abortion to be the murder of babies. There can be no compromise to satisfy them. Regardless, they will feel that abortion is being forced on them, even they would not be forced to obtain an abortion. Many red states are passing laws that either ban or effectively ban (“heartbeat” bills) abortion. These laws are unacceptable to pro-choicers.
Roe v Wade WAS a compromise. Few restrictions in the first trimester, more restrictions in second trimester, few abortions permitted in the third trimester.
93% of abortions occur in the first trimester. No woman, 9 months pregnant, suddenly decides that she no longer wants to be pregnant and gets a convenient abortion. In some situations, it is necessary to terminate a late-term pregnancy for medical reasons (health of the woman, fetal death or terminal malformations).
Republican politicians, fingers in the wind, are recommending a ban after 15 weeks gestation, with exceptions for health of the woman. This is essentially Roe v Wade.
The pro-lifer hope is an amendment declaring zygotes, embryos and fetuses as persons with all rights and privileges of the born.
For every black baby that isn’t born there’s a racist democrat like Rimjob cheering in the background.